Market Update

[Skittcat]

It's just a damn shame for those who are affected by this.

Those affected by this quite simply set themselves up. If I were you, I'd stop arguing; and unless you can come up with a 110% legitimate reason this shouldn't continue, stop instigating this debate since it's clearly not going anywhere.

Coming from someone who is probably most effected by this, I'm gonna have to agree with Moses. We really did set ourselves up.

Also coming from someone most effected by this, It's a good decision. I love Opti's economy and want to see it remain; this move is a hard choice, but the right choice to see that the economy remains. Whether or not the economy was the point of the server or not, it has become deeply ingrained into it and is a very important part of many of the players decision to play here. Therefore, if removing ingots will help preserve that, then it is a good move.

[SalsaInABowl]

I say we adopt girlluvzermac's idea the was talking to me about the other day.

Elaborate.

[SonicHogSpeed]

Sheesh, this is becoming as hectic as when the melons and pumpkins were removed, if not less.
Lando, if you mean no offense, you should probably learn to keep your thoughts to yourself. Reading all that made me offended by the attitude towards the actions that have been made. And all those smiles, winks, and cheesy smiles really got on my nerves… It really doesn't help me think you mean at all "no offense"

[DJAlphaWolf]

No point in continuing this arguement. Even if the community agreed with you, Nick's mind won't change. Bythe looks of it, more people agree with Nick, then those who don't. The majority consensus agrees with Nick.

As much you want this to be a democracy, it never was and it never will be. The people will influence our decisions maybe but they won't have the final decision. In this government, admins/owner make the rules they deem fit for our server. And they have every right and reason to do so.

I see no further reason for arguement. Someone lock this.

[Nick3306]

This will remain open to prevent creation of new topics about this on the forums.

[Chief149]

I should add that those of us who spent a ton of hours and moneys making our farms did not set ourselves up for this. Rather, Nick set us up for this.

Ok, lets look at melons and pumpkins. They got out of hand. They were removed from the market...

Cacti... removed from market slightly before it got out of hand, but it was expected to get out of hand. Removed.

Hmm... What is the next farmable thing to move to... Sugarcane? Nah. Too cheap in the market. Only remaining thing is iron and gold. History showed that the farming of the other things were getting out of hand. Twice. So why were gold and iron ingots left in the marketplace when it was obvious that they'd be the next big farmed thing? We weren't setting ourselves up for this. The admins did. They waited until we put tons of effort into these farms, and now the items are being taken out of the market. This wouldn't be a big deal if iron and gold ingots were removed from the very start when it's obvious that people would move to farming them. And of course, this decisions so thinks of the player, right? Nah. More like the staff just doing what they want.

[DeeKay]

Welcome back Chief. =)

[UnknownHedgehog]

I should add that those of us who spent a ton of hours and moneys making our farms did not set ourselves up for this. Rather, Nick set us up for this.

Ok, lets look at melons and pumpkins. They got out of hand. They were removed from the market...

Cacti... removed from market slightly before it got out of hand, but it was expected to get out of hand. Removed.

Hmm... What is the next farmable thing to move to... Sugarcane? Nah. Too cheap in the market. Only remaining thing is iron and gold. History showed that the farming of the other things were getting out of hand. Twice. So why were gold and iron ingots left in the marketplace when it was obvious that they'd be the next big farmed thing? We weren't setting ourselves up for this. The admins did. They waited until we put tons of effort into these farms, and now the items are being taken out of the market. This wouldn't be a big deal if iron and gold ingots were removed from the very start when it's obvious that people would move to farming them. And of course, this decisions so thinks of the player, right? Nah. More like the staff just doing what they want.

Wait, you knew that gold and silver would be removed from the market. Like you said, history showed that since it happened twice in past that they'd be removed eventually due to farming.
So you, knowing full well that gold and silver will one day be removed, still put in tons of hours and a lot of money into the farms, despite knowing they'd be removed... That's not the staff's fault.

[Lando_V]

Sheesh, this is becoming as hectic as when the melons and pumpkins were removed, if not less.
Lando, if you mean no offense, you should probably learn to keep your thoughts to yourself. Reading all that made me offended by the attitude towards the actions that have been made. And all those smiles, winks, and cheesy smiles really got on my nerves… It really doesn't help me think you mean at all "no offense"

Well, Sonic, to be honest, although it doesn't concern me personally, I'm quite pissed about the whole situation now.
Learn to keep my thoughts to myself? Who the hell are you to say that?
I have the right to share my opinion about the whole thing and I did, nothing more.

I said no offence.....and you make it personal.
I was already done with this topic but you pull me back in!

All I did was share my opinion and suddenly I get a load of criticism. Nothing bad at all, I can handle criticism and I think I replied in an appropriate manner. But then you replied completely offtopic and in a very personal way.
You are out of line!

Please stay on topic.

I'd even prefer it if this would be locked.

[clawstrider]

Let's keep this civilised.

Yes, a decision has been made. Yes, it's final.

Raging or complaining about it won't help.

[Lando_V]

Let's keep this civilised.

This ^

[Felix]

I'm only going to comment on the responses by Lando_V on my previous post in this thread and only directly answer those points addressed to me and not the rest - I will try to keep my responses brief where possible and try not to bore everyone to death in the process - and of course mainly 'cos I cba with the responding to the rest of the post!

(click to show/hide)

Not only do they stretch the distance between the "haves" and "have-not's"

You mean of course the distance between the "non-lazy" (those who actually build stuff including big farms) and the "lazy" (those who do not).

No. I didn't mean that at all! "The haves" I was referring to are the majority of the longer term players ('cos the HAVE money) & "The have-nots" being the newer/younger/inexperienced members ('Cos they don't) of our community
It has absolutely nothing to do with being "lazy" or not. Have you forgotten how to 'play a game'? Games are for enjoyment and your level of enjoyment maybe completely different to mine, or indeed someone elses. Some people are happy to run around a field doing nothing all day long

Because contrary to real life it is actually possible in Minecraft for EVERYONE to be rich.

Who cares? To quote a blocky version of King Leonidas.. "This is MINECRAFT!!"

...for very little effort...

For making a good farm it is required to invest a LOT of time and effort!

true, at the beginning, setting it up does take time, afterward.. ZERO effort!

Your remark is just as ridiculous as saying that building a navy base requires very little effort...

in your opinion... but go on..

Have you ever tried to fill 27 cells with 4 pods each with at least 4 villagers each? That's 4x4x27=432 villagers minimum.

No, but...

Yes that takes time and effort.

ok.. but

Have you ever tried to mine 13 full double chests of obsidian? THAT's the equivalent of time and effort!

ok, you lost me now... wtf has 13 double chests of obsidian have to do with (I'm presuming because of the maths lesson (4x4x27=432 villagers)) your iron farm? Ahhh, wait... ok, I gottcha... your gold farm.. ok... go on..

...they take up too much valuable space on the server and you've got to admit, they're pretty damn ugly too.

have to agree that most farms look damn ugly. It's a shame people don't invest a little bit more time to make them look good.

of course..

And yes they take a lot of space but valuable? I don't think so.

I do, otherwise I wouldn't have said it..

Most valuables have been stripped from the land, there aren't many goodies left to mine.

So find somewhere that hasn't been... and strip that out

Added to that, there are so many abandoned houses or half finished houses taking "valuable" space. THAT's the ugly stuff! It would be nice if crap like that would be removed.

Have you spoken to any Staff members about the possibility of removing some of the abandoned structures?

Or, if there is such a lack of space, why not just add extra land to the maps?

Sorry, but didn't 'they' just do that?

During the building of a big farm you don't earn money.

You're doing it wrong then!

And when the farm is ready the amount of money is not infinite. Even when you spend an infinite (24/7 ? ) amount of time afk-ing (which no one has the time for) a farm produces only a certain amount of items per hour. So "infinite money" does not exist, no matter how big the farm is.

eh? Yes you can have "infinate" money. As long as your balance remains above zero..

And as I said earlier, trying to sell to others isn't nearly as effective, even with a big price difference. People just won't buy all your stuff.

But people DO buy your "stuff".. I have made more sales in both gold and iron over the past few days than I have ever sold to the market... (which isn't hard, I've never sold ANYTHING to the market, ever!)

- I enjoy playing on this server very much!
- I try to help other players, try to teach them how the game works and I still learn stuff myself.
- I don't buy from anyone, I don't sell to anyone, I'm completely selfsupporting (that means mining every block I use myself).

Cool, me too (ok, maybe not completely self-supporting, I try to cheat my way through and donate for my in-game money so I can buy blocks)!

- I think the economy on this server is a joke.
- As long as there is a market, the term "survival" is a joke.

Eughhh... you were doing so well... Do you mean that you love the server, but I hate it at the same time?

- The minigame /baltop, which a lot of people like a lot, will become a joke from the moment iron and gold are removed without wiping /baltop for a new start.

Pretty sure you'll find that most of us already think that "/baltop" IS a joke, hence the removal of pumpkins & Melons and now the increased need for even more valuable items such as Gold & Iron

So in short; The best way to deal with the current problem is to remove the market entirely, making this a true survival server. It would solve everything instantly but a lot of people would be very disappointed.

LOL, I knew that was coming after the bit above - It would not be beneficial to the players who have donated (like me) to have our balances zeroed because people will always try to find a way (round the system) to make more and more money..

The current solution of removing iron and gold is a terrible solution that doesn't realy solve anything and only causes disappointment among a specific group that deserves to be disappointed the least of all players!

Wait, what? Why exactly do 'they', the people that have iron/gold farms deserve less disappointment than someone who doesn't?

If the afk-ing is a thorn in peoples eyes then we should attack that problem specifically. We must focus on how to solve that instead of using other harsh measures.

Yes! I agree. Connect a system up to their computers that as soon as they go afk, they get burnt with a drop of acid. Joking aside; The afk kicker has been put in place, but people, for whatever reason, probably because they (some people) just don't know how to 'play fair', or maybe they find it impossible to join in with the community and just want to stand there (or pay someone else to stand there and afk) so at the end of the day they can say "Look at me. I'M RICH" with their fake Minecraft money.. Who knows.. I wouldn't know, I only go afk for food/comfort breaks/or when I fall asleep at 5am at my desk.


So, to sum up - In MY opinion, Economy is there for a little bit of extra fun - Don't take everything so serious, it's just a game (again; To quote a blocky version of King Leonidas.. "This is MINECRAFT!!")

[Holy_Moses]

Nick set us up

Cute, but he really didn't. We (aka staff/"the problem") litteraly watched as dozens of you built ridiculous, ugly, fun-ruining, golem-murdering farms to make money. Which basically made the whole point of the market go to complete shit. Idk the exact numbers but you know youd make hundreds upon thousands of dollars a day by making the iron farm just to brag about how your high you are on baltop. Which isnt the point of the game in the slightest bit.

[Nick3306]

I should add that those of us who spent a ton of hours and moneys making our farms did not set ourselves up for this. Rather, Nick set us up for this.

Ok, lets look at melons and pumpkins. They got out of hand. They were removed from the market...

Cacti... removed from market slightly before it got out of hand, but it was expected to get out of hand. Removed.

Hmm... What is the next farmable thing to move to... Sugarcane? Nah. Too cheap in the market. Only remaining thing is iron and gold. History showed that the farming of the other things were getting out of hand. Twice. So why were gold and iron ingots left in the marketplace when it was obvious that they'd be the next big farmed thing? We weren't setting ourselves up for this. The admins did. They waited until we put tons of effort into these farms, and now the items are being taken out of the market. This wouldn't be a big deal if iron and gold ingots were removed from the very start when it's obvious that people would move to farming them. And of course, this decisions so thinks of the player, right? Nah. More like the staff just doing what they want.

This is funny because you say that I set you up for this, as if i knew the farms would get this big. We did not, you may be able to see into the future chief, but we cannot. Trust me, i've tried and failed every time.

[Pugabyte]

I would like to ask:

Does anyone on opticraft use an iron farm but then spend the money they make from it on blocks to build cool stuff? Because if you do, you have our condolences. This is the last thing you needed. For everyone else, you had your fun, now get to building.